---
title: Episode 151 Stalemate Seduction
episode_number: 151
era: late
source_file: Episode 151 Stalemate Seduction.mp3
audio_size_mb: 55.1
duration_sec: 1805.1
duration_min: 30.1
language: en
provider: deepgram
model: nova-3
diarized: true
confidence: 0.997
transcribed_at: 2026-05-27T17:03:29Z---

# Episode 151 Stalemate Seduction

**Speaker 0:** Podcast a 151. This is the Tom Torero podcast, your weekly daygame dose of degeneracy. I hope you're licking the lid of life wherever you are. Today's podcast is on stalemate seduction. This is a nuanced, you could say advanced topic. Practical in comparison to last week's in a game waffle, you might say, let's get back to daygame. And guys keep saying, where's the advanced material? Well, if you are an advanced daygamer, I suspect you're not listening to this podcast. You don't need to. You're free flowing. There is no structure. Okay? There is no verbal spike to learn. You are on autopilot. You've been doing it for a long time. You're certainly not watching YouTube videos or podcasts, and your mind is blank. It is zen. You're not reading textbooks. You're not thinking about what you're doing. You're in flow as Michael Cixson Mihael says. Alright. So elite tennis players or the world's top football players, they ain't reading books about tennis or football. That's not to put you down. That's just to say it's weird when guys ask for advanced material and perhaps they don't know the beginner structure. But today's topic, would say, is intermediate to advanced because it's something that's very common. If you have gone from mister nice guy daygamer to a bit of the bad boy to fast sex, especially when you're traveling. This podcast will apply to players, bachelors that travel the world that are in cities for very short amounts of time. And whilst this might sound cool and you watch black sheep bandit and you say that's fucking cool, my van schedule has been even more pithy, even more extreme, extremely short than the flights because I don't need to do flight booking or Airbnb booking. Am hopping, not bed hopping because my bed stays the same. Thank God. That's nice. But I am hopping from city to city to city to country to country to country. So what happens, you generate leads, you go on dates, you get her on the bed, you get to, you know, just about to cross the point of no return, you don't get the notch but then you're moving on. And what do you know? All good day gamers will know this. Two days later or two weeks later, you're in another location. And either you get a drunken horny text from her saying, where are you? And you sob because you're hundreds of miles away. Or she she suddenly comes back on the radar and she's keen to meet. And once again, by then, you're in a different city or a different country. That's really what we'll talk about today and strategies to get girls back into the game because I'm sure you know what stalemate means, but I've been thinking about this concept for a long time. And recently, I was in a city watching old men play chess, a very nice quiet activity in the park. Now the sun has come out. And, yeah, I was thinking about this concept of stalemate in game and pickup and daygame. Nobody's really talked about it and how to use stalemate and how to restart the game. Anyway, I've gone too far deep inside. I need to stop, give you some token LMR, and give you some news that if you go to my blog, tomtorero.com, you'll see that I'm posting a lot of lay reports, not from me, but from guys all over the world that have emailed me their stories. Now these are not fisherman's tales or wild exaggerations. You can tell they're real, through the pain and the suffering and the way they're written, the roller coasters in there. Sometimes they put their stats in there, and they're inspiring much more than listening to a day game coach talk about getting laid. These are guys that are doing crazy things. So if you've done some secret society stuff and you've got laid, it doesn't need to be a same day lay. But if it's a good story, especially the secret society stuff, then email it to me, tom@tomterrero.com. Don't worry. Of course, I won't publish your email or your your name or even your city. I'll give you a reservoir dogs, mister o or a mister j or a mister t. Fool. Remember that mister t? Yeah. I'll give you a pseudonym, and it will be fine. And if it's really good, if it's, like the one I've just published about that toilet pool in the Hippodrome Casino in London, then I'll stick it in my new book below the belt because that is exactly what the book aims to do. Good girls are just bad girls that haven't been caught. I wanna shock men out of this idea of she's different from all the rest, or she's a good girl, or she would never do that, or she's religious, or she's educated, all that bollocks. Okay? The girl is your mirror and these crazy things are happening all around you. Just because you're not doing it or she's not doing it with you, my friend, she's thinking about it and sometimes she might do it. Okay? She's a shape shifter. So she's a good girl and she's a bad girl. Depends on her age, time of the month, circumstances, and you. Okay. Are you the rock star that approaches her or are you the potential sweetheart to marry? That's the new book and that's what these lay reports uncover, undress. So send me yours. It's nice to hear from daygamers all around the world. Okay. Let's get back to stalemate seduction. Ladies and gentlemen, a new daygame topic. I'm quite nuanced. So if you're just starting out, you can listen to it. It's a bit of a for you, it's a bit of mental masturbation. You should be focusing on getting over a a generating leads and going on dates. That's all you need. Okay? Once you're going on dates, you'll get to this topic. And you could say, you know, the famous saying, the game isn't over till it's over. Well, today's topic, once you've reached stalemate, unlike in chess, we're gonna think about how can we restart it, how can we get out of that position. The first thing to note and this is interesting is that daygame is not a cumulative game. I you don't get reward stickers from her and then when you reach 10 stickers, she opens her legs. A lot of guys, especially the nice guys and guys that are unaware of game, you know, the gay best friend, they, or even the white knight guys, they do things for the girl, they clock up their hours, they carry her shopping, they help her with her homework, they treat her nicely, and then they say, where's the lay? And she's like, well, obviously, not verbally, she's saying I'm not attracted to you and he's like, what? I don't understand. And then those are the guys that get very angry. They think it's a cumulative thing and that you could negotiate attraction and then, you know, it should just be like the checkout at the supermarket. But no, it's very much like chess. So you can play really, really well. You know, your day game can be good. Your texting can be amazing. Your dating can be good. And then maybe at the end of the first day, like I do many times, you cross the point of no return. You go a bit too far. You make one blunder and the hours of hard work are gone. That's it. You might never see that girl again. She wins if you like that game of chess or it's a stalemate. Nobody wins. And the mark of an experienced player, both a chess player and a daygamer is that you're working hard right until the very last move. Okay. We're not talking about yes skills today. Yes skills are nice. We get them sometimes but they're not game. Right? Fools mate, as Mystery says, is is not chess. It's nice when it happens. You can use it but it's not skill. It's not nuanced. So a good player might be playing a very hot girl, right, for daygame and seduction. And he's thinking about game and using the whole ass and all the whole Torero Toolkit Street Hustle available, cha ching. And she is as well. Obviously, subconsciously, but girls are playing their game. She's testing your metal, she's shit testing you, she's making you weight, she's using push pull. And, yeah, right until the very end when she's on your bed. And let's say you get the notch, it's an incredible feeling. I wrote a lay report up. I'll link it because I can't remember even what it was called, but it was about chess and about how I spent so long seducing this Russian girl and then getting the notch. And a notch like that feels so much better than just the yes girl from, you know, gutter game outside a kebab shop. She's horny. You're horny. Bang. Nice lay. But when you're really using your skill against the hot 18 year old who's also got a lot of skill, it's good. Okay? You're pulling off a high level chess game, a heist. And that's real game. The game is played with maybe girls. Okay? That's why it's called a game. So there's no point going, why do I have to play all these games? Right? Game denialism, listen to the podcast or why doesn't she just come over and fuck? That's a common email I get. Tom, why don't you just say to her on text, come over, let's fuck. Why are you playing all these games? Why why all this manipulation? A lot of guys say, why does she do something different to what she said she was gonna do? Right? Or, the latest one going around the community is, why don't girls just chase me? I've built up all this value. I go to the gym. I've got white teeth. Why doesn't she just chase me? Bitches. There you go. So these are slippery slopes into game denialism. Basically saying chess doesn't exist or getting angry with your chess opponent because he's better than you. He's using moves. And you're like, what? You can't use moves. Why can't I just win? That's the equivalent of what you sound like if you're moaning. So rant over, avoid that. We're talking about game. It's called game. You have to learn the rules. You have to learn techniques. There are hustle moves. You can play you can play against weak opponents. You can play against amazing opponents. I. E. Gills below you in SMV, gills above you in SMV, you know what I mean. Right. Let's get on to the stalemate. Okay. And in chess, it's just one of the ways in which you can have a draw. And in chess, it's if the player to move is not in check but has no legal move, then that's stalemate. That's nerdy, but let's link it to seduction and pickup. So you've both shown your hand if you want a poker analogy. So we're not talking about no girls where she's just wasting your time and, you know, she just enjoys your texting, but the fish has disappeared. There's no way you're gonna catch the fish. We're not talking about that. We're talking about situations where you've daygamed well, you've texted well, you've dated well, she's come out, you've made out, you've been back at hers, she's been back at yours. There's sexual chemistry. She likes you. She wants to spend more time with you. She's turned on by you, but it's just too fast. Right? You want the fast sex. She wants a bit more of the attention. She wants a bit more of the spending time with you, etcetera, etcetera. Yep. And I've spoken about that in who wins who folds first. That's a good podcast a few episodes back. Who folds first? So you could think of it like this, if you're using the chess analogy, you win as a guy by getting fast sex with very little affection or companionship or investment. And she wins, if you like, by getting from you loads of affection, loads of companionship, loads of investment, but no sex. Right? Harsh, but true. Now, I know we talk about two types of hustle and the bait and switch or the win win type of hustle, but it's not binary. Another problem in the community right now is that guys are completely convinced that you're either the lover or the provider. And they say therefore she's either the whore or the sweet good girl next door to marry. And loads of day day gamers misunderstand this. But if you've daygamed enough, if you've slept with enough women, you know that even as the lover, even as the crazy lover like in that toilet pull they report that I just put up or some of my really fast pulls. Girls want the chance for things to progress. She might not know that consciously, but that's just in her hardwiring. That's where buyer's remorse comes from and the anti slut defense comes from. The idea, the possibility that she'll see you again. Now that doesn't mean as a charity boyfriend or you giving her money or marriage. It just means that, she doesn't wanna feel stung. Right? And recently a girl summed it up to me. She told me we were talking about good lovers and bad lovers and she said the ideal lover is a guy who's not too distant but not too clingy. I'll say that again because it sums up this technical point. She said the ideal lover is not too distant. He's he's just a total fuck boy where he fucks it once and then he vanishes. But it's also not too clingy. And lovers often become clingy, you know, daygamers often give up game and then just cling on to the one girl and she's like, well, I thought it was just about casual sex. And he wants the affection and she's turned off by that. Right? So girls want repeat sex. She doesn't want this buyer's remorse. She doesn't necessarily wanna date you, but it's just in her head that she wants to know that there'll be a repeat fuck, that you're not gonna vanish completely. It's not the bait and switch. Alright? But the stalemate goes like this. You've been on her bed. She's been on your bed. She's not letting you get the notch. You know, this token LMR. You can sense that you need more time, a second date, a third date. You need to put in a bit of investment, but you're not gonna do it. She's not giving you the notch, but she knows that you're a direct guy, you're not a chode, you've gone for it, you've made out, You've literally g y d o, got your dick out. And recently, this has happened to me with three girls. Now, like I said, in the van, it's it's a lot harder, you could say, than getting an airplane in an Airbnb and being there for two weeks or a month. I certainly wouldn't recommend it to beginners because I'm going to smaller cities, less approaches, and I'm leaving the city pretty soon after. And I've got three girls, three different situations where one is they've all been on my bed, know, we've all we've had the blue balls. She knows what I want. But I know in all three cases, if I was in that city and I put in a bit more work, bit more time, she'd be happy with it. She'd give me the notch and should be in a harem. Okay? None of them, I'm not pretending that I would be their boyfriend. That is the bait and switch hustle number one in street hustle. But one girl's got exams right now, but she's given me a date after which we could, you know, get it on. She sent me naughty nudie pictures, but I won't be here, or I won't be in her city rather. One girl's constantly away with her parents because there's a problem in her family but again we just need more time and the last one is just gone on holiday to Croatia and when she comes back I won't be here so I was running the train and just burning it way too fast. For this, I should say, you've got to know the difference between a time waster and a girl where you know it's on. So again, a beginner lacks this calibration to know when he's being played or when the game's in play. You're essentially trying to play fast chess. What's that called? Rapid play. But she wants to slow down and play traditional chess. The beginner will pursue roads to nowhere. He'll pursue dead leads. He'll become clingy. He's going after fish that are not even in the lake anymore. They've swum away. They're not interested. That's why I made that Dutch flaking video. You should watch it if you get a lot of flakes and you write to me and say, Tom, how do I get this girl Anna? I've sent her 16 messages and she's not replying. She's not interested in you. It's a no girl. Move on. Forget about it. But I want to get Anna. No. She's not coming out my friend. She's fucking the milkman or whoever. She's fucking four guys. Just just leave it. Move on. But but but No. That's essentially what a lot of Skype sessions are. Okay? Oneitis for that one special girl next door. Now we're talking about girls where she's genuinely disappointed that the game of chess is over. Alright? When you reach stalemate, the game's finished and she was enjoying the technicality of it. You were enjoying the tech the quality of it, but you walk away from the table. It's different to the role flush where you kick over the table and the board, and that has a 1% chance of, working where she then gives you the notch. It definitely has worked for me in the former Soviet Union and in places like Russia, but no. I've said much better to, you could say, end it with a with a draw where you both walk away calmly, you know, you don't get angry, you don't let it upset your vibe, you didn't get the notch, but you didn't fall into her friend zone trap. You didn't hang around for months or years like perhaps you would have done in the past. You didn't get the notch. You didn't get the affection, but no hard feelings. Alright. Delete her off your Facebook. Bye bye. Now, the even more juicy stuff because you're in stalemate or in no man's land, nobody's winning, nobody's advancing. You can feel it if you're an experienced daygamer. It's frustrating. It's like tug of war where you're both the same strength. You're pulling, she's pulling, nobody's budging. And you know that just with a bit more time or taking it a bit more slowly, not being such a player, you could win. But you're just like, oh, fuck this. Pull, pull, pull, rope breaks or you just drop the rope, you give up. Is there a way to get back in the game? Now, in chess, you might have heard of something called a chess swindle where you're in the losing position, but then that player tricks his opponent into a win or at least a stalemate. But let's go for the win. Let's go for the notch. Let's go for the plus one. And now in chess, the swindle word doesn't mean, by the way, cheating or fraud. It's nothing unethical. Okay? It's just the word swindle. And, swindles are very artistic. You might have heard of Frank Marshall if you're a chess nerd. Marshall's Chess Swindles is the book on how to do it. So like I said, either to win or at least get to stalemate. And he talks about sacrificing your remaining pieces just so your king's left, so there's no legal moves. You stop the game. You save face. You haven't lost. You're not in the friend zone. But let's think about winning. Let's think about resetting the game. And this is the sneaky stuff. This is the swindle stuff. This is moves. And if you're horrified by these moves, you don't understand why it's called game. Okay. Now, not a conscious game as I say in pretty much every podcast. Don't need to get angry with her. She doesn't even know. Girls are playing expert chess, on autopilot. They've grown up with an amazing social awareness and fantastic understanding of social dynamics. You've probably learned it, alright, from street hustle. But anyway, how do we reset if you've been pulling pulling pulling in tug of war or you've reached this position in game. What I do and what I've done with these three girls is to suddenly stop pulling on the tug of war rope. Just put it down and walk away from it. So think about, you know, the cat and the ball of wool and you're dancing the ball of wool around and the cat's dancing around, but then suddenly you just put the ball of wool down and leave the room. And the cat looks at you like, oh, I thought we were playing a game. So in game, you might know that as the forty eight hour roll off. Certainly, silence over texting. And this is very hard to do if you've had a girl on your bed and she's hot and she's texting you, you have to not get drunk and no drunken texts. Have a wank if you're horny. Don't text her. So silence. Twenty four hours is not enough. Forty eight hours is good. And what's happened with two of the girls today, I used this move today. Two of the girls have texted me once, and then I didn't reply. They've sent another one, and one of them sent, another one with a question and a photo. So, when you stop playing the game, the girls are oh, shit. Have I lost him? Okay. Fear of loss. You might have heard me talk about this before. The the counter intuitive truth is that she gets more attracted when you don't text her than when you do. Now, once again, we're not talking about no girls who just don't text you back. There has to have been the attraction and the arousal already. Right? But then suddenly you don't text her. She's thinking about you more than if you sent the world's best text message or the world's best photo ping. Think about that. Okay? Silence is golden. I used to say in seminars, give her the gift of chasing you. Give her the gift of chasing you. Let her miss you. Let her fill in the blanks. Let her think about you. Let her get jealous in her mind, you know. Her mind is going crazy. She's writing this plot in her head. Make her sweat. Yeah. Not literally. We don't like sweaty girls. And what this roll off does, this forty eight hour roll off is it resets the game. And in some circumstances, like I'll talk about in a minute, you can reset the game after a week or after a month or even after many years. I shall tell you a funny story about many years. And you reset the game, and what you can't do in chess is putting pieces back in play and carrying on after this stalemate situation. Alright? So rather than getting in a half and doing royal flush and kicking the board over and ruining it and never seeing that girl again and saying what a whore on a on a pickup forum, You're more clever. You're resetting the game. Alright? A real sneaky trick, which, daygamers are aware of. My buddy, Ian, does this a lot. He will, let's say he's left the city where that girl is and she doesn't know that he's coming back. He will just check into that city, check into that place on social media. So, you know, update his status to say he's landed in that airport on Facebook or whatever on Instagram using an old photo. And she will see this and she's obviously thinking, right, he's clearly gonna chase me and send me messages and ask me to come out, but you don't. And then you wait. She will message you, hey, Tom, I didn't know you were back in Barcelona. And by then, here's the gold. You say, oh, I'm I'm already back in London, or I'm already back in Poland, or I'm already back in wherever. She will be shocked. Right? For the first time in her life, a guy's not chasing her. And girls love this feeling of chasing a guy because vis a vis, he must be high value because he must have options because he's not being a needy, supplicating fucker. That's how it works. Alright? I've said before the highest form of game is when she chases you. And I know it's not easy to do and we're not movie stars and male models, but understand that principle. If you don't understand that, then you don't really understand, you know, your chess opponent and the chess moves available to you. Use jealousy plot lines. So I've been sending those girls obviously pings of me doing interesting things, pings of you socializing. And one girl said, oh, I wish I was there doing those things, you know, because you might know that she loves, I don't know, Stephen King movies and you ping her a photo of you and somebody else watching a Stephen King movie. Oh, I'd love to be there with you doing that. So jealousy plotline. Right? You're preselected. Just make her sweat. This is a clever one. I think I spoke about it in daygame three point zero, which is on stealth seduction, the full video series of that. The first two, think, are free on YouTube. But anyway, I talk about some advanced things with mirroring her. So, you know, when you're, initially going after a high value girl and she you sit try and go for the date request and she says, maybe, or she uses words in her messages like, let's see, or she takes two days to respond, or, she just replies l o l or interesting or you say, let's meet on Wednesday and she says, let's try or even worse, she says, I'll let you know. Anyway, that's right at the beginning, opening game, but now you're almost an end game. You, my friend, are gonna flip it and do it to her. So when you feel like girls, two of these girls are, trying to get me to go back to their city, and I'm using words like maybe, let's see, let's try, I'll let you know. Right? Beautiful. Now, said I'll tell you about the world's longest loop close. I'm sure a guy's done longer than this, but, I've closed loops, after a reset months or, a year or two after leaving them. But the longest was a girl that I kissed when I was 14 or 15 at school, a very spotty nerdy teenager. I kissed her but she had a boyfriend and I chased her for a bit and fucked it up, you know. I was I I was clueless. And then obviously, I forgot about it. Then obviously, I got on with my life and then eventually I found pickup and started traveling and she was liking my Facebook pictures. This was about 2012, 2013 and I went back and yeah, she was my age so what she was 34 then 33, but she was a gym instructor or some kind of aerobics girl, so she was in good shape. And you know why I went back to Wales to smash her, which I did? It was to close that loop psychologically for closure. And that sounds stupid and weak, but if you went through a shitty period as a teenager, if you didn't get those early references experiences, you'll understand. And at the time, she was very cute. She was not the hottest girl in school, but she was certainly top tier. And to go back and smash her, and she was she was just so shocked at how I I looked different, I behaved different. She asked me many questions about how, I had changed. And the lay was easy because, you know, how many years of comfort is that? But anyway, let us finish because the clock is running down and I wanted to talk about that technique as well, running down the clock. So if you wanna get out of stalemate, daygamers these days, are often one trick ponies. I'm, accusing myself of it too, where you turn up, you do the daygame and the texting, one venue, one drink, let's try and smash her. So really, you know, you're looking for strong maybe girls, quite easy, simple, fast, lazy, that's fine. But, as Mystery correctly says, the average, open to, pee inside v is somewhere around seven hours. Now immediately guys go, no, that's bollocks. I banged a girl in nine minutes. I banged a girl in two hours. I banged a girl from a kebab shop and I'm just saying on average, if you look at it, if you divide up, you know, your first day and the second day, maybe even the third date, five to seven hours, you're safe, you're comfortable. Why? Because you've got that comfort in there. You've got that rapport in there. You've got that non neediness in there. It's not just pull, pull, pull. Yep. You're playing higher level strategies like making her chase or you're merging her into a second date into a with another girl. You can read about that in my first book, daygame, where I merge two girls into one date and let them fight it out. You can friend zone a girl, you know, and use her as your wing girl to pick up other girls. These are all high level tricks that day gamers do not use. More and more, it's just becoming smash and grab. Speed chess, which I understand if you do day game for ten years, you're sick perhaps of the dating, but I'm just telling you there's these techniques out there. So once again, read Mystery Method, go back to the old school theory, read chess books, and you, my friend, will be shocked at these tools available to you. Right. We shall leave it there. A half an hour podcast for free, on a new concept, I hope, getting out of the stalemate or at least getting too stalemate. If you feel like you're losing, use the chest swindle and get to stalemate so you, you don't get angry. You keep your head held high. You didn't get head, but, you didn't get friend zoned. So move on to the next game of chess. But I want her. I want Anna. No. You just open up another window, open up another browser and start another game of chess. And if you're good you can play 20 games of chess at the same time which is what a black sheep bandit in a van is trying to do until next week stay horny my friends goodbye