---
title: Episode 84 The Joy Of Hedonism
episode_number: 84
era: mid
source_file: Episode 84 The Joy Of Hedonism.mp3
audio_size_mb: 57.3
duration_sec: 1876.6
duration_min: 31.3
language: en
provider: deepgram
model: nova-3
diarized: true
confidence: 0.997
transcribed_at: 2026-05-28T07:25:31Z---

# Episode 84 The Joy Of Hedonism

**Speaker 0:** You wait when they wanna come. Relax. Don't you wait. Podcast 84 with Thomas Torero, the joy of hedonism here from Japan. My last few days in Japan before flying to London. Few days in London with the family and friends and then flying out with mister Craig Cassidy to Las Vegas where there shall be debauchery, there shall be guilty pleasures, there shall be hedonism which is all the topic of today's podcast. But before we come on to that, before we delve deep into the delights of daygame, I like that alliteration, I promised you I'd go over some more supplementary Japanese daygame questions. Now a lot of people are asked questions that had been answered in last week's podcast, podcast 83. So don't be lazy bastards. Listen to the podcast. Timothy and I clear up some of the Japanese daygame issues. Also, I should have said, watch the videos on my YouTube channel called flow mad part one and flow mad part two. And they're from a while back about a year ago where I break down traveling to daygame. I break down accommodation. I break down flights. I break down, mobiles, sims, money, passive income, working from your laptop, being a flow mad, a digital nomad who is in the state of flow. And our flow, if you're listening to this podcast, is doing beautiful day game. But, anyway, got some more questions on YouTube and Twitter and email, etcetera. The biggest one was, yep, where do we stay? And now I spend my life traveling, so you could say where do I live If it's not on a friend's sofa. And hotels, no. Love hotels here in Asia, no. It's always, apartments. Alright? Sometimes if I'm traveling alone and the city is very expensive, it might be a private room in a shared house. But I make sure if I'm doing private rooms that the owner's okay about guests. You know, he's not there all the time. Maybe there's a separate entrance. Maybe there's a a bathroom included. Maybe it's a shared bathroom. But if you can, and in Eastern Europe and Central Europe and South America and parts of Asia, you can just get the apartment. If you're traveling with another daygamer, obviously, it's cheaper. Sometimes I travel with two, three guys with wings. We share the cost of an apartment. It's brilliant. As I say in flow mad, you've got a kitchen. You've got a living room. You've a sofa. You've got a TV. It's just like any other apartment like your house. So girls are much more likely to come back to watch a movie or play the guitar, if you can find a guitar or whatever, to do some cooking with you and then go into your room than if it's a hotel. If it's a hotel, she panics. She feels slutty. That's the ASD, anti slut defense. She might have buyer's remorse afterwards because she feels like a hooker. You might get cock blocked by hotel staff if you've booked a single room and you bring a guest back after 11:00 or whatever. If he's a night guard, a male, he's gonna cock block you and ask to see her ID because he thinks she's a hooker. He's cock blocking, etcetera. All these things have happened to me. Love hotels. Yeah. They sound cool. Couples use them. Couples that have been dating for a long time in Japan, they can't have sex under their parents' roof so they go to love hotels. Or guys use them with hookers. But it's different. As I said in last week's podcast, we're not here doing pay for play. Right? This is not the usual Asian quote unquote game that guys talk about. This is taking normal girls from the street or coffee shops or book shops, taking them on a date, and then daygaming them. Yep. As in doing the Torero dating model and yep, it's not a nightclub pool so you need some plausible deniability of where you're going and, I'll talk about how I've been getting on here. But, yeah, accommodation. So use the website Airbnb. I will link it below on iTunes. I'll link it below on YouTube. Second question, which three guys asked me, is it easy? Is Japan easy? Is it the Shrang Ri La? Is it the pussy paradise? Is it just white guy? There you go. Get slayed. No problem. That's what a lot of guys imagine. Again, because of all these Asian stories coming out of Thailand and Vietnam and Philippines where it's a bit dodgy as to what's going on. The answer for Japan is no. I'll give you the stats in a minute, but it's exactly the same open to close ratios as in most of Europe, as in The USA, as in Australia. They don't need your money. They don't need your passport. They don't need your help. They are certainly not poor here in Japan as in, the mass middle classes. Very developed, very clean, very tech savvy, obviously, very happy, very content, very functioning society, an amazing place. So, no. You're not gonna just come in and swoop down and all these girls are going to drop their panties. Now you have to put in the the normal work and you're going to have the normal problems plus the stuff I talked about last week. So sure, it's an amazing country but don't come here with this idea that you're gonna do three approaches and get laid three times. It's certainly not easy. And that links to a question from Michael or Michael. I think he's Michael from Russia. He wants a data sheet as in results. And, as I've spoken about in other podcasts, I do keep my own private data sheets for the cities I visit as in how many opens I've done, how many leads you get, how many dates you go on, how many lays you get, different notes. Because for each city, I want to know what's going on with me. Now remember this is for me. For you, it will be different. But it's good to know which cities work for you, which cities you like. I've spoken about this in a podcast where I say that if you don't track data, you're just going out there blind and saying you know well I hope it goes well I have no no idea how many guns I opened I have no idea whether this city was better than this city sure you don't need to be anal about it We'll talk about that in today's podcast, but it does help. So to give you an example, this is the data sheet for my nine days here so far. I've done around 70 approaches, maybe 75 maximum. I've got 22 leads, which I can see here in my line, which is like their WhatsApp. So that's around a 31% close rate, which is okay. I told you, not super easy. That's like Germany or that's like, yeah, Australia. That's like Los Angeles or New York City. I've had three eye dates, and I was only pushing the eye date when I thought it was the same day lay. I've had six dates, and I've had three lays. Two Japanese girls and one Thai girl. One of the Japanese girls, that will be in stealth seduction. The other one was a couple of days ago. That was from a first date. Very, very shy girl. No English at all. We had no Wi Fi in Starbucks. It was down. So she had this shitty old school translator on her phone, like a dictionary, and I was writing things in a notebook. And then I said to the I said the question, you know, why are you single? That's one of my verbal spikes. A qualifying question. And she said, or she translated, I'm not. I have a boyfriend. And I was like, oh, how long have you been going out? Two years. Do you live together? Yes. Do you love him? Yes. Are you gonna get married? Yes. And I thought, oh, fuck. So I thought, right. Just gonna down my Starbucks coffee and that will be that. And then I noticed the deep eye contact. I said what kind of movies do you like? I said what do you like to drink? No. I said what kind of movies do you like? And she said whatever you like. So I suggested, look, we can go and watch a movie now. Stop off and buy the alcohol that you talked about in the supermarket. She was like, yep. Okay. Back to mine. Still no Wi Fi. So stupidly, you know, got nothing saved this time on a hard drive or on my computer or on a memory stick. So I was like, fuck. Fuck. Fuck. I can't show her daygame videos. So I found this photography documentary that Craig Cassidy had given me. That was the only thing I we could watch on the hard drive, put that on. She resisted the kiss. It was all very no. No. No. Then we were spooning and hugging, and then we were kissing. Then there was token LMR, and then she went crazy. She was so sexual. She liked wrestling. She liked, like, super physicality on the floor, on the balcony against the wall. She was nuts. And I'm seeing her again, I think, on Thursday. So that was a good lay. The second lay was with a a very tricky Thai girl, a business kind of girl, 25 years old, staying in a hotel with her colleagues. She comes over to Japan to do business. They go back and forth. They work in some kind of energy industry. Anyway, long story short, I had instant dated her off the daygame approach and had almost got back to her room. I'd got to the lobby of the hotel. She said no, couldn't come up because of her colleagues. Then for the next few days I was trying to make her come here but, she was too nervous about that, about her colleagues finding out. So I thought it was a goner and then late one night, we were texting back and forth and I suggested sneaking into her room once her colleagues had gone to bed And that's what I did. She gave me her room number. I went up in the elevator. We I snuck in. I think her brother was next door. He's part of his work party. And, that was a notch. So there you go. Three lays, nine days. I'm happy with that. Oh, and I had one other I had one kind kind of milf, not a milf because she didn't have kids, but she this woman that had just been divorced for a month, she came on a date. She came back here. We kissed on the bed. We fooled around, and then she was in a sad mood. She said she couldn't stop thinking about her ex husband, so that wasn't her lay. But if you factor her in as in four girls on a bed, that's one lay for every 17.5 opens. If you don't factor her in, that's one lay for every 23 opens. So why are we talking about data? Well, for me, it matters. Am I gonna come back to this city? Am I gonna come to Japan? Should I try South Korea? How does it compare to Hong Kong? How does it compare to Singapore? Etcetera, etcetera. I like knowing this stuff. Anyway, next question because I'm jabbering on. Are the girls hot? Steve says, well, they're not my type, but I concede. I can tell the difference yet between just cute, average, and there's some very kind of, very nice anime manga type hotness there. If you like that kind of thing. But I'm missing long Slavic legs and just banter. You know? I'm sick of this giggliness. I love real good banter with English girls, Canadian girls, American girls, where you can really show verbal daygame dexterity. That's what I miss. That's what I love. Rob says, have you tried Tinder? No. As I said in Singapore, delete Tinder. No. No. No. When you see an expat guy walking around here with a Japanese girl, he's probably got from online social circle TEFL teaching. That's teaching English as a foreign language or probably Tinder. The quality is really bad, like two or three points beneath him. And remember, game is dating a girl, who's hotter than you, let's say, by two points or younger than you significantly. Yeah. She's just hotter than a girl you'd get from Tinder. So, no, don't go near it. It doesn't make you strong. And anonymous said, what's negative about Japan? Because I seem to rave about Japan. Well, I love Japan. I love Japanese scenery. I love Japanese food. The girls are fun. I love the Japanese kind of techno technological technological technological culture. What's the downside? The cost. I'd say the cost. Living here and having coffee and beer and food is the same as New York City or London or Moscow. So, nope. This is not a cheap Asian bolt hole. You pay the price for the high quality of living. But if you can afford it's worth coming here for one week, two weeks, whatever. Right. Let's dive into today's podcast. I think we got about twenty minutes left, and the topic is hedonism. The joy of hedonism or debauchery. Alright? Getting down and dirty. Flicking your middle finger to mediocrity, to the average, to the sensible, to the joy killers. Yep. So it's about pursuing pleasures. It's about tasting this rich tapestry of life. Yeah. Diving into this, this buffet of wonderful things. We'll start with some quotes. Woody Allen said, love him or hate him, Woody Allen said, you can live to be 100 if you give up all the things that make you want to live to be a 100. Rita Brown said, I finally figured out the reason to be alive is to enjoy it. And my favorite one from Tom Robbins, he said, salvation is for the feeble. That's what I think. I don't want salvation. I want life. All of life. The miserable as well as the superb. And I've always been like this. I got this from my debaucherous dad and even my mom who's who's a very, very sensible, wonderful, loving, religious, good, angelic woman. But she she's she's never so strict, so fundamental. She always says, you know, to live a little, to relax. In in America, they said, don't be square. And I was certainly a square in, for a lot of my high school, certainly in university. Know, You when I wasn't drinking, I was being very sensible going to bed at a certain time, strict diet, strict habits, no fun, no fun, no pleasure, must be sensible, must be good. So I was quite angelic. But now, as you know, I preach the black sheep grabbing life by the horns going for it. And when I teach daygame, I've seen thousands of students, and many, many, many are far too square, you could say, without making fun of them. That's not to blame them for their lack of experience. That's what they're getting into game for. But many guys are obviously very serious, very logical, very in their head, very stifled. I think they say in RSD, very rigid. You know? You can see them. They're trapped in their own reality. They've created this very logical reality, and they're trapped in it. And if you think about game, daygame as being a trance of emotions, what you feel she feels. Now you can understand why even though that guy jumps in front of the girl and he does the London daygame model and he uses my teases and spikes and challenges and, you know, follows all the date structure, his underlying energy, his underlying frame, underlying vibe is very stiff. Not in that way. Just stiff in a kind of an awkward way, in a square way. And and girls can feel this. Alright? And sadly for seduction, the serious vibe, the high IQ vibe, the logical vibe, the disciplined vibe is often a massive turn off. Now we don't like to hear this because right now you're listening to a podcast on seduction where we're logically trying to explain how women behave. So in a way it does make sense to be logical and learn all these tips and tricks and structures. But there comes a point when you need to show a willingness to emote, as Mystery says, one of the big attraction triggers. I e, learning to let go. I've spent my whole life learning to let go, to be unstifled, as Tyler might say, to be imperfect. Right? This is why girls love the bad boys. Yeah. Because they're sexual, but also because they're wild. They're unpredictable. They're dangerous. You get this whirlwind of emotions. It's risky. The bad boy smokes. The bad boy drinks. The bad boy takes drugs or sells drugs. The bad boy might have been in prison. The bad boy likes fighting. The bad boy drives a motorbike. All these things spike her emotions, and she's addicted to the drama. Yeah? That's why in my early dating model, when I put out girlfriend sequence long a long time ago, I had a second date as an adventure bubble now. Since then, we've contracted that model. The model's shorter, and I only do that adventure bubble date if I've overexcalated on the first date. That's like the bridge date. Yeah. So you might take her for a bike ride. You might play pool with her. No. You're not spending money on her, but you're just doing something unpredictable, something fun. I often do karaoke. Yeah. You're showing this side of you which isn't super serious. You're showing her this side of you where you can let go. You don't take life too seriously. You can laugh at yourself. You can laugh with others. This shows very healthy balanced emotions in a human being. And surprise, surprise, women are completely hardwired and sensitive to this. So they can tell if you're in your head. They can tell if you're out of your head. And don't go giving me that excuse that, oh, I'm I'm an introvert, I'm never like that. Well, if I went out with you and I gave you two or three beers, we did a bit of karaoke together or we did a bungee jump or a skydive or some river rafting, I would slowly see you start to unwind. Or if I could watch you chatting to your best mates down the pub, the way you interact with them, that shows that you can do it. And I'm an introvert, you know, and introverts don't do well in big groups, but I do do well one on one. And when I relax with good friends or with girls, I can be this, uninhibited, relaxed, fun guy. Very, very healthy sign. And I'm always suspicious I tell girls this. I'm always suspicious of people that are too good. Right? I'm always suspicious of people that deny they have this other side to them. That's why I'm drawn to the debaucherous characters. I'm drawn to the underdogs. I'm drawn to the Seedy. I always have been. I'm drawn to the Burkowskis, the Hemingways, Dylan Thomas, you know, spot the similarities. I'm I'm drawn to Scorsese. Something with grit. It's real. It's raw. It's flawed. And that's what makes it human. Right? The human condition being that we're pulled between the mud and the stars, and that's where we are. So just to say that, we need to be super good and we need to all the time be perfect. Well, that's, a, it's unrealistic. B, it's hypocritical because the more you repress something, as I said last week, the more it comes out in weird and wonderful ways. And c, that's just boring. Right? The the human condition is interesting. That's why I watch documentaries. It's interesting because we're flawed. That's why I lived in Soho in London because it's it's still just about the seedy part of London where all things happen and and people are open. I like those kind of grungy dive bars where there's no pretentiousness. I don't like VIP red carpet roped off cocktail bars with a guest list. I like it where people, can hang out. Yeah? So my dad used to say, never trust a guy who doesn't drink. Right? I know some guys can't drink for, whatever, health reasons, religious reasons, but if a guy doesn't drink or, you know, a super strict vegan guy or whatever, If you haven't really got drunk with someone, if you haven't seen someone at their totally relaxed state, then you haven't really seen them. They're always putting on a bit of a front. Yeah? It's definitely true. In my experience with with guys, with friends that you don't really know someone until you've seen them drunk. Because when they're drunk and that forebrain shuts down a bit and you can see them operating from the midbrain, the hindbrain, that's when you say, ah, that's how that person really is. That's what they desire. That's what their core character is like. Yep. The full brain gets in the way. And we often used to joke as, as daygame instructors when I was working with a whole group of instructors, we used to joke, look, the best boot camp for a lot of guys that are stifled and are in their head and are awkward, would actually be just to go and get them drunk, take some lines of coke, take them to a strip bar, get the strippers to do some really filthy things to them, get in a few fights, ride ride a motorbike or take them go karting, smash the place up, whatever. We were being ironic. We were being flippant, but you know what I mean. Sometimes for some guys, like when guys watch the movie, the hangover, and they get a glimpse of that world. For some guys, that's what's needed, you could say, alongside the learning game structure, game principles. Just learning to let go. That's huge. And I often forget how stifled and how serious and how logical I used to be. And it gets in the way of game. But it it's also a problem in life because the bigger issue when, you say, okay. I want to be, you know, super straight. I want to be super square. I want to take the moral high ground. This puritanical approach is is I would say hypocritical. Right? It's judgmental. It's gonna lead you with big leave you with big feelings of guilt and shame. Yep. And this is gonna surface in really, really weird ways. It's like at the moment, there's, there's the health cult, you know, where guys are saying, okay. Must have x grams of protein. Y grams of zinc. I only eat this, this, and this. I have to get it from this store. It has to be cooked like this. You know, super fundamental about it. Again, that's it's it's almost OCD. It's this need for control. This inability to let go or you get those work freaks. That's a current fad at the moment where the guy is like, eight zero three wake up, eight zero seven do my mantras, 902 do gym, 10 o one do my emails, you know, everything structured. And they see any kind of free time as negative. It's like, must always be working, must always be pushing, must always be hustling. No time to be. No time to think. No time to remember you're alive and you're gonna die. No time to enjoy world. Obsessive need for control. Oscar Wilde said, punctuality is the thief of time. Because whether you're constantly thinking about the past or you're constantly thinking about the future, that just means you're not in the moment. Now, of course, I'm all for pushing, for hustling, for discipline, for structure. But I'm saying you can't go too far that way just like you can't go too far in the wild, debaucherous way. Yeah? Otherwise, you end up in prison or a drug addict, miserable, fat, whatever. So to be a good pickup artist, you need to have this relaxed side to you. And all the best daygamers, nightgamers, seducers I know have a very relaxed side to them. So when you're in their presence, even quote unquote naturals that are very good like this, you you just feel that they're relaxed about themselves, they're relaxed about life. They're not easily triggered. They're not easily wound up. Small things don't bother them. They don't lose it all the time. They're not constantly playing, defense. They're not prickly. Yeah. They're they've got this lovely gravitas about them. And that's a really good way of telling if somebody's banged a lot of girls because girls obviously pick up on it too. Yeah? And that's why it's called the pickup arts, not the pickup sciences. Yes? It's not all fact. It's not all logic. Think about the the true nature of women. They are emotional, illogical. Now I'm not saying that as a negative. That's that's a beautiful thing. Men, we need to learn from it. Yeah? Like I said in the beginning of the podcast, game is a transfer of emotions. And beyond picking up women, let's talk about persuasion. People are persuaded by emotions. Even though men, we like to think of facts and figures and that's useful for going to the moon. When you're trying to sell somebody a car, it's gonna be done largely on emotions. Yeah? Pickup arts, not the pickup sciences. And art is messy. Human life is messy. People can sense the real because they recognize the messy. Yeah? And, when you read good literature or you see great movies or you see good art or you see good pickup, people recognize it and enjoy it because they say, that's it. That's me. I've experienced that because I have those flaws, therefore I'm not alone. That is the power of art. That's what I'd say what art is. So pick up art is included in that and good pick ups are not perfect. I've said many times they're three d, not two d. They're polyphonic. Very messy. Even though we present idealistic models of this is daygame, open, stack, vibe, and she hooks, invest, close, and then the date goes venue one, venue two, and then, you know, it's all laid out. Many times you have to be adaptable. It's three d. It's it's polyphonic. Now, guys are going fucking up. Right. Do I need to start shooting up heroin, smoking weed, getting drunk every night, gambling? That's what Tom is saying in terms of grabbing knife by the horns. No. Alright? Obviously, uncontrollable vices and addictions can destroy you. They can stop you achieving what you wanna achieve. They can you lazy. They certainly start messing up other people in your life. Definitely your family and your friends, those who care about you. I don't need to explain why uncontrolled hedonism is bad and why Dylan Thomas died of alcoholism. Burkowski shot himself. Hemingway shot himself. So, yes, just take lessons from them in terms of their their opposition to authority, their opposition to being perfect, their opposition to being squeaky clean, to being angelic. What can you do about it if you are feeling a bit square, if you are feeling a bit logical, if you are feeling a bit OCD, if you are a little bit German? Here's some practical suggestions. Right? Get drunk. Get drunk with friends or get drunk with random strangers. Okay. Hi. Now in California with random strangers. Go off to Amsterdam. Smoke a little bit of weed. Relax. Remember, you're gonna die. Alright? Go and sit by the beach. Go to the mountains. Go into the desert. Look up at the night sky. Look at, the sea. Breathe it in. Go into a forest. Right? Speak to some random guys. Not just random girls, but use your daygame on guys, not for a gay game, but to meet a group of lads and have a kind of hangover bachelor experience. If you're in a hostel or if you're backpacking, book a spontaneous trip. So even if you're working Monday to Friday, just have a really weird weekend break. If you're brave, and I've done this in the past, just go to the airport and you haven't even decided where you're going and, look at the departures board, go up to the ticket desk, buy a ticket, just fuck off for forty eight hours. Complete change of scene it will wake you up yeah do something extreme like I always talk about go skydiving jump off a bridge do some hang gliding go kayaking take up marathon running, whatever. Something just to wake you up out of routine. Right? And indulge. Shock horror. I'm gonna get a lot of criticism for that from these gym freaks and from these health freaks and from these workaholic freaks. No. Stop. Indulge. Enjoy the food of the world. Right? Savor the taste. Spend all day just one day eating doughnuts if you want. Go for a massage just for you. Have a day in bed. Stop feeling guilty about everything. Yeah? No. Not a long term thing. I'm just saying. Stop. I try to do this. And when you're eating food, when you're putting food in your mouth, think about why it's so nice, why it's so tasty, where it came from, how it's amazing you can get all these different tastes. Yeah? It's just like standing in the shower. We go and have a shower. Guys are in there for two minutes, and then we're out. Fuck it. One day, just stand in the shower for half an hour until you're all bloody wrinkly and enjoy having a shower and say, this feels fucking good and it's for me. No. Don't wank in the shower. Enjoy the hot water. Yeah. Turn it to cold. Stand there. Imagine you're in a waterfall. Imagine you're underwater. Just think, fuck. This is good. Right? This is an indulgence. Enjoy some, music. Splash some money out on a nice hotel room. Do something where you spend money and you in the past, you'd have gone, fuck. I shouldn't do that. I shouldn't do that. Oh my god. What are people gonna say? Fuck it. Alright? Can't take it with you. Right? Money is for experiences. Get on a jet ski. Money can't buy you happiness, but money can buy you time on a jet ski. And have you ever seen someone unhappy on a jet ski? I've said that many times before. Even simple things like taking a different route to work. Right? Break your routine. Take the bus instead of the train. Take the train instead of the bus. Walk instead of the bus. Take a bike. Walk a different way around a park. Try eating something new. Try wearing something new. Right? Tomorrow, me and Timothy, we've just brought some bus tickets and we're gonna go into the middle of nowhere and climb a volcano. And we didn't know we were gonna do that till about two hours ago when we googled things to do around here. We thought, fuck it. Let's climb a volcano. Right? Take a few risks. Don't be risk averse. Don't be too in your head. Don't be too squared. Don't be too serious. Don't be too logical because it's not good for picking up girls and it, is certainly not good for life. Life is too short. So pursue pleasure. Sometimes it's okay. You know? Be debaucherous. And as I said, flick that middle finger to mediocrity. Alright? Next podcast is from The UK, I think, before a real hedonistic end of the year in Las Vegas with mister Cassidy. Until then, keep grabbing life by the horns. Over and out.